Legacy, Health and Innovation: Stories of Hope with Terri Liggins

Terri Liggins' journey from Las Vegas back home to Columbus, Ohio, was not just a change in location, but the start of her caregiving story that she passionately shares with us on the Season of Caring podcast. Losing her father, taking care of her mother, and dealing with life during a global pandemic is a story that many of us can relate to. Terri openly shares the challenges and unexpected blessings of caring for a loved one, giving listeners a heartfelt look into the realities of preparing for life's uncertainties.

Terri recounts her and her mom's transformation by the remarkable benefits of a raw, plant-based diet. Our discussion also touches on the solitary nature of caregiving. Terri and I emphasize the critical need for self-care to prevent burnout, underscoring that caregivers must replenish their own wells to continue giving to others. This is a testament to the power of dietary choices and the delicate balance caregivers must navigate to maintain their own well-being while supporting their loved ones.

The episode culminates in an exploration of innovation within the caregiving community, as we delve into Terri's creation of a caregiving app, 4th Quarter Lifestyle . This tool will stand as a beacon of support, offering resources, legal assistance, and community connection to those who give so much of themselves. This celebration honors the stories that unite us, the power we gain from shared experiences, and the sense of empowerment that results from easily accessible and professional assistance. Join us for a conversation that acknowledges the resilience of those in the trenches of caregiving and offers a dose of inspiration for anyone navigating this season of life.

Chapters

• 0:00 Caregiving and Legacy Transformation
• 9:59 Caregiving and Healthful Lifestyle Choices
• 26:28 4th Quarter Lifestyle Caregiving App

Transcript

[00:00:00] Rayna Neises: Welcome, this is Rayna Nieses, your host of A Season of Caring Podcast, where we share stories of hope for family caregivers, breaking through the busyness and loneliness of life to see God even in your caregiving season. I'm so glad to welcome you today and I'm excited to introduce you to Terri Liggins.

[00:00:19] Terri has been a successful ghostwriter for prestigious clients over the past two decades, a bestselling author and a health and wellness advocate who discovered the disease fighting power of eating raw plant based foods to get rid of 12 year long autoimmune disease in just seven days.

[00:00:36] She is passionate about helping baby boomers and others transform into healthier beings and live a legacy through sharing their stories. To that end, she created a mobile app, Fourth Quarter Lifestyle (RQL), that connects individuals with professionals across the United States, offering a range of products and services, including living wills, asset protection, estate planning, downsizing, and so much more. With advanced degrees in business administration and law, Terri is a true powerhouse entrepreneur based in Las Vegas. Explore www.TerriLiggins.com to learn more. Terri, welcome. And thank you so much for being here today.

[00:01:16] Terri Liggins: Thank you very much, Rayna. I appreciate that.

[00:01:20] Rayna Neises: Yeah, you have quite a unusual background, lots of different things, but in the mix of that, I know that you had taken care of your mom. So share with us a little bit about what that caregiving season looked like.

[00:01:31] Terri Liggins: Yes, that came, that season of caring for my mother came very unexpectedly because she's been a very healthy person. She's in her 80s, but has always taken care of herself, never been on meds pretty much her entire life. And I had been prompted, I had an umption to Move from the West Coast, where I live, Las Vegas, back to Columbus, Ohio.

[00:02:01] To really look after help look after my dad He was the one with more of health challenges nothing serious though But health challenges at this point he had had a hip surgery So he wasn't able to return to the home that he and his wife have because it's two story So he was in a facility and I felt that I could really help out. I have siblings there. They work nine to five jobs I, as a writer, can work wherever my laptop takes me. So I just felt that, let me go, let me help out. It wasn't a first thought though that came to my mind, but like I said, it was definitely an umption from the Lord because I was thinking about those winters. I'm like,

[00:02:43] Rayna Neises: Yeah, not fun. Not compared to Vegas, right?

[00:02:47] Terri Liggins: like I'm fine here on the West coast without all that snow, but I knew I had to do it. So I went there. And my dad unexpectedly passed within four months of me being there. So I had pretty much moved my whole household there, expecting to stay for a while. And it just fell into place that, well, now mom, I guess I'm here to take care of you.

[00:03:16] And again, like I said, she wasn't ill or anything, but what I realized, she did not have her affairs in order. It is so very common. And finding out how many people don't. I had not updated mine, so I'm in that category also. But when I talk to people just, you know, in general conversation or if I'm going on purpose to speak with them about an article that I'm writing about caregiving, it is just more often than not that people do not have their end of life. issues, you know, their final wishes, all of that wonderful paperwork that nobody wants to talk about. It's not about, it's not filled out. And, and, you know, growing up, I really admired my father. He was strong provider leader in the whole community. So imagine my astonishment when I realized that he didn't have his totally prepared either.

[00:04:18] So I was on a mission at that point. I said, okay, I am going to get my mother in order and update my information at the same time. And Rayna do you know, it took like almost six months to get it all figured out. The living trust, making sure you have things in that living trust. Setting up one,

[00:04:39] Rayna Neises: Yes. Moving at all.

[00:04:40] Terri Liggins: yeah, you know, setting up one. That's great. That's a very good first step. But if you don't have all your items,

[00:04:47] Rayna Neises: doesn't do you any good if there's nothing in it, though.

[00:04:49] Terri Liggins: exactly, exactly. You're just making the attorneys , you're filling their wallet, but it

[00:04:56] Rayna Neises: Yes.

[00:04:57] Terri Liggins: you know, because your assets are not saved at all. So That was pretty much what was going on with me. And do you know, timing is everything, God, because all of that happened right before COVID. Months into, leading into COVID, I was already there. So, it made it perfect. It was just the perfect recipe for taking care of my mother. As I said, I have siblings who are there with their spouses and they live in town. But guess what? They would have been just I don't know, leaving dinner on the porch for her,

[00:05:35] Rayna Neises: Sure. Yeah. Mm hmm.

[00:05:37] Terri Liggins: you know, helping her out. People were panicking. They were not going to see their loved ones and me already being in the house, you know, I was okay.

[00:05:49] Rayna Neises: That is amazing. I love God's timing. I don't know about you, but when I look back on my life, there's things that I didn't even know I needed that he set up just like that. You didn't even know that you were going to need to be there because who had heard of a pandemic before it happened?

[00:06:03] We didn't even know what it was going to be like. So that's amazing. And I love that you were there to keep her company and she was there for the same thing for you, because it was such a blessing to have someone to Stay with and even just to have conversations about the crazy, right? And, try to bring each other into that place of rest and God versus the panic that was happening in the world.

[00:06:27] Terri Liggins: So And to be doing it in a healthy way. Yes, out of the hospital, that was key. That was key as well. My mother being in, at the time she was, I believe she was 85, wow, 84, 85, still working. She was well, she works for herself. She's a private piano instructor and her studio is in her home. She goes out to some of the students, but most of them, 95 percent of them come to the home where she has a studio set up.

[00:07:03] Guess what happened when the pandemic hit? Nobody. I was going anywhere. She wasn't going to them. They weren't coming to her. She panicked a little bit, like, oh my goodness, what am I going to do? Again. I was there. Thank goodness I was there and not having to help her over, over the phone. I said, well, here's what you're going to do, mom.

[00:07:26] You're going to learn zoom.

[00:07:30] Rayna Neises: we all love Zoom?

[00:07:32] Terri Liggins: And I must commend her because there are some people who are 20 years or junior who refuse to get on zoom

[00:07:39] Rayna Neises: figure it out.

[00:07:40] Terri Liggins: to learn it. She figured it out. All of her students, almost all of them maintained their sessions with her via Zoom. And she even brought on new students who she has never met in person because they started during the pandemic and they started on Zoom.

[00:07:59] So, yeah, 40 students, about 40 students a week is what she,

[00:08:04] Rayna Neises: Wow. She's a busy lady.

[00:08:07] Terri Liggins: is. She is.

[00:08:08] Rayna Neises: amazing.

[00:08:08] Terri Liggins: And so that would have been a significant. Drop in you know, income to household to not have any of that happening. And it's been wonderful. She still does some zoom. Some of them are on zoom still. Oh, because yes, because she has some from all over the country.

[00:08:28] Rayna Neises: I was going to say, cause I opened up the area, you don't have to travel there. So yeah. That's amazing. How neat. Well, I know one of the things that you experienced with your dad was just those end of life paperwork and things that you mentioned and kind of reaching that place where there were decisions that had to be made that were really difficult.

[00:08:50] Share with us a little bit about that.

[00:08:53] Terri Liggins: I must say, though, with my father, because it happened within those first four months that I was there. I didn't even have a chance to venture down that road. He and his wife had been together for a couple decades. And so, one makes the assumption, which shouldn't be the case, the assumption that all of that was taken care of.

[00:09:14] I was more concerned with just really being there while she was there most of the time, but they were needing to sell their two story house and move into another house. So she was there, you know getting the house renovated. And, and just still as a school teacher, part time school teacher, she was still doing that.

[00:09:31] She was very, very busy. And so that was my, my thought process was to go there and help out wherever I could. So I spent a lot of time with him in the facility where he was and attempted to get him to eat a little healthier. He wasn't having some things he could deal with, but green juicing, just the color. He, he, you know, so we had some really fun moments, him teasing me about about my way of eating. At this point, as you mentioned in the introduction, I had adopted a lifestyle that was totally different than most of my family members. 90 percent of what I eat is uncooked, unprocessed raw plant based foods. Grains and nuts and sprouted items and all of that and that was to get rid of a disease which happened gosh 12 years ago I went hard on that because I was sick and tired of being sick and tired I've been dealing with this autoimmune disease for 12 years in and out of the hospital So when that opportunity came where I learned about nutrition, I'm like, I'm all in, I will do this.

[00:10:38] And so I went 100 percent from eating junk food. I mean, I love to drive through, you know, if that could replace me having to cook dinner. That was where I was in somebody's drive through. So I was eating pretty poorly. And, I went just from one day eating like that to the next day eating 100 percent raw plant based foods.

[00:11:02] So that is what got rid of everything I had, annoying things menopausal things on top of the autoimmune disease. All of those things went away in just seven days. So I was sold on it at that point. Over the course of six months, I lost 30 pounds and that was without any major exercising.

[00:11:22] So no one could tell me otherwise that this, you know, was not the right way to eat. Introducing it to my family members though was a little, you know, that was a whole different thing. And so you have to let people just kind of come on board as they wish unless they had some really serious medical things, then I would get persistent.

[00:11:46] And that was the case once with my mother in 2017. She had a. Mild stroke and as I mentioned, she had never really been on meds her entire life. The only time she was in the hospital was to give birth to her five children. She had an ear infection, inner ear infection back in 2017 and this particular doctor gave her antibiotics that within a week of taking those antibiotics, she had this stroke.

[00:12:15] Yeah, it was just. you know, too much for her system. And so I flew there to take care of her to make sure she wasn't going to take all of those meds that the hospital was prescribing to her. One after another, I was like, Nope, we're not that. Nope. Not taking that. Nope. She's not taking that. And would you believe Rayna, that within five days, of just feeding her living superfoods as I eat and giving her two tablespoons of hemp seed oil every day, and we got rid of, they had prescribed statins for her, they said her cholesterol was a little high. Statins, no human should be taking statins, right? So I was doing the food for her instead of statins. And when she went for a follow up, the doctor was like, wow, what are you doing? Cause he was looking at the report from the hospital compared to the tests he had just given her.

[00:13:19] And he said, your cholesterol, your bad cholesterol has come down 50%. And this is in days, just five days. He said, whatever you're doing, keep doing it. And he said, I'm 30 years, your junior. First, he couldn't believe she was 80 something. He said, I'm 30 years, your junior. And my numbers have never looked this good.

[00:13:38] So

[00:13:40] Rayna Neises: Wow.

[00:13:41] Terri Liggins: I just, you know, so what can I say? So when COVID came along, it just made sense. Keep feeding my mom the same type of foods to keep her out of this. Yeah, yeah, when everyone was panicking and rushing to the hospital, you know, we just did it a different way. So caregiving comes in a lot of different stages.

[00:14:03] Rayna Neises: It does, and their willingness. I mean, you brought up a good point too. I think we have to work with what we got and convincing them to work with us and to make some of the changes. When we were caring for my dad, the doctor recommended we go dairy free and, One of his things. He loved ice cream every night.

[00:14:22] And I was like, gosh, when you're 85, you should get to have what you love. And so I felt terrible taking that away from him. And so we were able to find some alternatives. We actually were able to find a rice dream that we could put some chocolate cover, you know, chocolate sauce on there. And, and he loved it just like he did his regular ice cream.

[00:14:40] So I think we have to find the alternatives and work with what we've got, but it definitely can be challenging and at the same time can bring so much benefit. So we do have to weigh those two things. So tell us one thing that you feel like is really surprising in your caregiving experiences.

[00:14:57] Terri Liggins: Wow. I had more experience watching other people in their caregiving role. Because I have several girlfriends who are caring for their parents. And what I found very surprising is how many people are going at it alone, not realizing the resources that are out there. As women, we tend to be the caregiver by default. It's sort of like in our nurturing nature to care without asking for help. I think that what a lot of it was not that the help wasn't available. It's that we aren't always asking for it because I know in my case, as I said, my siblings lived right in town anytime I would have asked them to do anything and anytime that I did ask them, they were Johnny on the spot ready to do it.

[00:15:50] But did I ask? No, mainly because of COVID. So my caregiver was because of COVID. So that was a reason. But yet they could still there were times when I couldn't take her to the doctors. You know, because of a Zoom meeting I had or something and someone else could do that. But other times, like if we needed an errand run, I just didn't feel right asking someone else. I would just do it. So a person can, in fact, statistics show that, unfortunately, the caregiver tends to die before the person they're caring for, and that is simply because they're not engaging in self care. Right. Yeah.

[00:16:42] Rayna Neises: agree. And I think one of the things that many times as I'm coaching and they're saying, but nobody else will help. It's like, sometimes I think we put it in a out in a way that we don't need help. You know, we're handling it. And also I think We have to be willing. Yeah, we've got that superhero cape on and we're just not asking. But I also think sometimes we get particular in the way we want things done. And I know as my sister and I were both caring for my dad, there were things that she liked and there were things that I liked. And we just learned to let each other have what we needed and not worry about it. But I do think sometimes there's that. Peace in which we have to let go and letting go of control is hard. And so sometimes people just disappear because they feel like they can't do it right anyway. And so they just stop offering or they stop trying. And we really do have to be open to whoever the Lord brings, whether they be family or paid caregivers or friends, there's support around you. You just have to look for it. So

[00:17:45] Terri Liggins: all around.

[00:17:45] Rayna Neises: point.

[00:17:46] Terri Liggins: Yeah. And I must say that, that type of tendency to do it all. Because only we can do it right. That starts even when we first have little children, I mean, when our children are very little and even when they're a baby. How many times? And it's changing a lot now. Back in the day there, it was a thing where the father was babysitting. Why is he the babysitter and not the parent, you know, and doing all these parental roles like the mother is. And it's because a lot of the times the woman is to blame because she keeps him at bay because he doesn't do it right.

[00:18:26] He doesn't change the diaper right. And you have to get to the point where if the diaper is even on backwards, you have to just say it's okay. It's okay. I see that diaper backwards. He did the best he could. I'm not going to complain about it. But I probably was one of those that I know I was probably, I was one of those that would redo something that was done wrong. I've learned, and if I were at that stage now, knowing what I know now, I would tell my 20, or I was 30 having children, I would tell my 30 year old self, Let it go. Let it go.

[00:19:06] Rayna Neises: Yeah, it is important. And like you said, I think sometimes earlier in life, we're in training for what it's going to look like later. And hopefully we have gotten better at letting people help and asking for help because it is very important. 

[00:19:19] So where would you say you saw God show up for you in these seasons of caring that you've had?

[00:19:24] No.

[00:19:26] Terri Liggins: From the very beginning, just getting me positioned there. As I said, I was happy as a clam here in Las Vegas, where the sun is shining 300 days of the year. And I had no intention, besides going back home to visit, which I would do, I don't know, a couple times a year, I had no intention of living there.

[00:19:50] I had not even lived there since leaving home after college. So, why was I to uproot and go there? Only God knew, but I just knew that I needed to go. He showed up in just being gracious with me though, initially. And, cause I did have some things I needed to take care of. And, when I, it took me about several months to finish out obligations here, pack up.

[00:20:20] Load up everything, go across country, and get settled in, and then, here's the, the interesting thing, because I don't believe in coincidences and and chance. And as I said, my, my dad's wife, she was very much hands on with his care and there in the facility as much as she could a lot. And then, you know, but having to run errands, she also takes care of her special needs sister and she was doing a lot.

[00:20:54] How is it that as he was transitioning to heaven, I was the only one there out of all the people who live there in town. I happened, you know, I don't want to say it happened to me, but I was there. God planted me there and I was just taking him some soup for the day. I was just, you know, thought, Oh, let me, run to the grocery store as I'm on my way to see him.

[00:21:20] Let me grab some soup and take to him and and he was speaking and I thought he was on his cell phone as I was approaching in his room. Until I got closer and I saw there's no cell phone and he was looking up, he did not even know I was in the room. And so as a ghostwriter of many years, what do I do? I record people's stories and write about them. So it was just a natural act for me to whip out my cell phone and turn my voice recorder on, memo, voice memo, I think it's called. And I started auto recording him and I don't think that anyone else would have thought to do that. Any other member, they would have thought it would have been rude or intrusive, or they just would not have thought of that.

[00:22:10] Rayna Neises: Right. Not cross their mind.

[00:22:11] Uh huh. 

[00:22:12] Terri Liggins: Yeah, it would have been more of a panic, like, you know, what's going on or whatever. But I just calmly pulled this out and started recording him. And so that was a nice gift that I could give. to, you know, LaDonna later when she arrived and he had already had his last breath. So,

[00:22:31] Rayna Neises: Mm hmm.

[00:22:31] Terri Liggins: and it's, it's, it's powerful. God just, whew, he showed up at that moment, I must say. And it, just the whole setting. My dad grew up just loving Westerns. I don't know, you know, why it was just part of his childhood, I guess there's a picture of him as a, maybe like a teenager or I don't know, young boy. And he had a sweatshirt on that had a Western, theme. He watched Bonanza all the time and all those other shows when we were growing up as kids, he watched all of them. And on, at that moment, when I was approaching him in his room, there was a Western playing him to be.

[00:23:15] Rayna Neises: Oh, yeah.

[00:23:17] Terri Liggins: That was the Western. So I didn't even turn the TV off. I just let it go. I'm like, wow, look at that.

[00:23:24] Rayna Neises: Yeah, he's favor it. That's cool. So I love, I love it when we have a chance to see God in the middle of it, because he's always there. We know that he is sometimes we just looking and recognizing it. So I love to hear different ways that God shows up for our caregivers, because I think it just encourages us as listeners to look for him more and be able to notice those times. So thanks for sharing that. 

[00:23:48] Thank you for joining us today, listeners and hearing stories of hope with Terri. Today's podcast is brought to you by No Regrets: Hope for Your Caregiving Season. A recent review on Amazon says Rayna provides a beautifully written book that is honest about her own journey as a caregiver, and helps to provide encouragement to others. 

[00:24:10] There's not a chapter that didn't speak to my own heart. As I am currently caring for my mother with dementia. Rayna provides great advice on how to support a loved one, but also reminds the readers to take care of him or herself. Although it can be difficult to believe that our caregiving season will one day pass Rayna and gently reminds us that we must always prepare for the day when there is a new season ahead. 

[00:24:36] No Regrets: Hope for Your Caregiving Season is my practical guide filled with stories and ideas of how to care for your loved one. If you would like to order your copy, you can find it at all major retailers or visit www.noregrets-book.com. And I do have a special gift pack with an inscribed version available. So again, let's jump into hearing some more about Terri and her caregiving season.

[00:25:03] So what would be one way that you feel like you've lived content, loved well, and cared without regret? It is.

[00:25:13] Terri Liggins: that's a good one. That's a, that's on different levels to also,

[00:25:21] Rayna Neises: We aren't always good at all of it and sometimes it can be trickier for sure.

[00:25:25] Terri Liggins: yeah, I think at different ages and different stages of my life, I contribute and as a writer over the past two decades. A lot of what I did 10 years ago, 15 years ago, writing individuals autobiographies. That's what I don't know how I came into that except a God thing as well. So I can't say I don't know how, but it is a God thing because I'm able to write in their voice.

[00:25:59] I've had client after client tell me that like, wow, you get me, you get my voice. It's just from, once I hear their story and we're conversing for a bit, I can kind of, I don't know, channel them. I don't want to say quite all, all that, but it's it is what I did a lot in being able to write an autobiography for someone and then handing them the draft and say, you know, what do you think of this? So. I think helping others tell their story so that it inspires and courage and empowers their readers, that was a way that I was giving back big time and sharing, sharing my talent to bring love and comfort and peace to individuals through those stories because some of them were pretty heart wrenching. 

[00:26:55] Rayna Neises: Yeah, using our talents to be able to encourage others, I think is such a blessing and it definitely is something that even as caregivers, we have a tendency just to have that heart, but learning to really listen and be able to share other stories. I think it's such a blessing. So thank you for that.

[00:27:11] So here is as we're winding down, tell me a little bit more about your app and about how people can stay in touch with you. Yes.

[00:27:21] Terri Liggins: asking about it. And the app Fourth Quarter Lifestyle. came to me, ooh, probably back in 2016, 2015, 2016, as I was watching one of my girlfriends helping her mother with dementia. And her mother is still with us and great in her body, but deteriorating in the mind. And so just the strength that it's taken for my girlfriend and her brother to really care for their mother. It's just, it's amazing. So as I was seeing this before I even had any duties of that sort. And even now, even as my father passed, he, he was fit in the mind. He never had any of that, but just seeing her find so many resources. She and another girlfriend, they were very, very on top of it.

[00:28:19] They researched and found, you know, how the state can pay you to care for your loved one. The transportation that's available, the adult daycare, things like that. They made, they did such a great job of it. And yet, then there were others who I would talk to who just didn't know any of these resources were out there. I thought, okay, I need to connect the dots . I need to allow those who know this information to connect with those who don't, and to be a resource or a shoulder to cry on at times. Because there were times that my, my girlfriend and I, we would just laugh about things that her mother was doing. We would laugh to keep from crying. They are doing things that a two year old would do, yet they have the attitude of I'm an adult, you can't tell me what to do, you know, you're in my house or if they're in, you know, like she's in her daughter's house and she doesn't want to be there because she wants to be in her own house. So it was just so many dynamics.

[00:29:23] The app was just an idea that how can I bring this. to fruition and allow people to have it handy 24 7. So that is a feature of it. It is 24 7 it's on your phone. And it's divided by state because there are different laws in the different states. Probate laws are different. If you are dealing with, someone passing without a will and what's going to happen with the house and, it's, Up in probate, probate, all of those things.

[00:29:57] It just, it's, it's amazing. There's, what I'm, what I'm realizing is that the more I know, the more I realize how much I don't know

[00:30:07] Rayna Neises: Ha

[00:30:07] Terri Liggins: So this

[00:30:09] Rayna Neises: Yep.

[00:30:09] Terri Liggins: a journey. I was able to pitch the idea. In the midst of COVID when, you know, when I was faced after being faced with it myself with my dad, I'm like, okay, God, you are giving me a taste of what it really means, with this caregiving thing to, to be open to see other things that are needed for the app.

[00:30:31] And then I had the opportunity in 2021 to pitch the idea to a developer. It's in the, it's in the beta stage right now. It is hopefully to be launched in 2024 ready for individuals to partake of it. I mean, there's so many additions to this thing that as it grows.

[00:30:53] Rayna Neises: Mm hmm.

[00:30:54] Terri Liggins: AI. How about that? With smart homes, you can have your if you're caring for your parent and you're in another state, which is the case a lot with baby boomers would even help unlock their door from a distance with your phone, with the app. So it, the opportunities are endless with this app. I'm very excited about it. And I know it, it is. Things like this take time and I have to be patient. I've learned to be

[00:31:20] Rayna Neises: hmm. Mm

[00:31:21] Terri Liggins: through it, as we're now, rounding into the second year, almost third year of working with it. But It, it will be grand when it's out targeting mainly baby boomers, but it could be for anyone. If you're caring for a special needs person and they're only in their 30s or 40s or something or a teenager or whatever, this app is for you as well. If you're an elder person that's caring for yourself, you're well, but you need to get your affairs in order. You would be able to go on the app and find attorneys who do estate planning, professional organizers who would do decluttering and downsizing.

[00:32:00] If you need to sell your house to move into a facility and individuals who are in home care owners or workers. I mean, it's endless. I'm really excited about it. And I can be reached at. TerriLiggins. com, that's my first name, T E R R I Liggins, L I G G I N S dot com, and there will be information there.

[00:32:29] Rayna Neises: hmm. Thank you so much for joining us today, Terri, and just sharing some of the stories and the journeys of what it's been like for you in your caregiving season.

[00:32:38] Terri Liggins: Thank you so much, thank you for having me.

[00:32:41] Rayna Neises: Thank you again for joining us on a Season of Caring podcast. Where we share stories of hope for family caregivers. If you have financial, legal, or medical questions, be sure to consult your local professionals and take heart in your season of caring.